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Hi all,

Minutes for Dec 6th, as always, questions, comments etc are welcome!


  • Ben Evans
  • Martijn Verburg
  • Trisha Gee
  • Michael Barker
  • Somay Nakhal
  • Richard Warburton


Carried over from last meeting

  • JSR-331 – BE to send to SE/EE list saying we’re going to vote no and here’s why. Before he does, check with Werner Kiel.
  • We need to update our voting record on (BE/MB)
  • Accept 351 invitation for webinar (BE)
    • solicit comments before the vote (BE to ask Patrick)

From this meeting

  • Set up a shared calendar for early JSR reviews and dissemination of our reviews (TG)
  • Get a volunteer to introduce Raoul-Gabriel Urma to the right people in the OpenJDK or his Relationships in Java prototype (MB)
  • BE reported that the proposed Currency JSR was still dormant.
  • MB reported that the tuples JEP this was very long term work
  • JSR 335: Lambda Expressions for the Java Programming Language – Early Draft Review – (RW to lead the Adopt a JSR for this one)
  • JSR 344: JavaServer Faces 2.2 – Early Draft Review – (Committee to seek volunteers)
  • JSR 339: Java API for RESTful Web Services – Early Draft Review – (Committee to seek volunteers)
  • JSR 346: Contexts and Dependency Injection for Java EE 1.1 – Early Draft Review – (Committee to seek volunteers)
  • JSR 342: Java EE 7 – (BE to investigate EG composition further)
  • Jigsaw: – Committee to investigate progress of JEP
  • Adopt a JSR materials for JUGs:
    1- The overview presentation. 5 minutes on what the JSR is about and what it means for the regular developer
    2- Technical deep dive – 10-60 minutes on how to use the result of the JSR, implementation details, best practices… All a developer needs to get from “Haven’t heard about” to “Almost Guru” (MV/JG)
  • MB to lead OpenJDK Adoption and set up a monthly regular session – find a venue via BC
  • MV to investigate with Oracle about access to statistical analysis tools.
  • Committee had a discussion on licensing in preparation of, conclusion was that until the lawsuit is settled, we have to wait.
  • MV to ask JUG leaders list to assist with further JSRs
Martijn (On behalf of the LJC JCP Committee)

The LJC actually had its 4th birthday on Tuesday and in just 4 years we have established one of the most active and rapidly growing Java User Groups in the world. When opening last weekend’s Open Conference I discussed some of the things we had achieved over the last year within the LJC.

– We now have over 2000 members including 600 that have joined over the last year.

– Over the last year we have had 40 events promoted through the LJC, including 25 of our own events. We have also been able to use the great reach of the LJC to help other user groups and communities such as JBUG and GGUG reach members that may otherwise not have been aware of events.

– We have had over 20 competitions through the group including software licenses, books and free conference passes to 6 different conferences.

Most importantly over the last year we have expanded our community into many new and exciting directions.

– We have given over 20 of our members their first chance at public speaking as part of the new pre-event lightning talks.

– Thanks to Brendan Quinn, we launched the LJC Aggrity site as a way to enable people to follow the personal blogs of all the different LJC organisers and members.

– Thanks to Ged Byrne we have launched the LJC Book club, which is starting to pick up momentum

– Ged and Dave Snowdon have started the regular code share events at Queen Mary University, enabling graduates and senior developers to come together in new ways.

Arguably our greatest milestone was to become part of the JCP and win an open seat on the Java SE/EE executive committee. This has really put us on the map globally and thanks to some great work from the LJC, the JCP committee has launched the ‘adopt a JSR’ program, which has been engaging other Java user groups around the world.

It has been a super year for our community and we should all be very proud. None of this would be possible without an active group of organisers behind the LJC. Thanks to everyone that has got involved over the last year, we have even bigger plans over the coming year and look forward to sharing our journey with you.


  • Richard Warburton
  • Somay Nakhal
  • Ben Evans
  • James Gough
  • Martijn Verburg
  • Trish Gee
  • Mike Barker


  • Review TODOs from last meeting
  • JSR-331– Constraints Programming for Java – Proposed Final Draft. We have Openness and Transparency Concerns.
    • There’s one potential Adopt a JSR LJC member that we can use to look into this (Lanre)
  • JSR-333 – Content Repository API – Early Draft Review, last day of review: 30 October 2011.
  • JSR-351 – Identity.  As we have major concerns about the validity of this JSR we should discuss whether to get them in for a presentation.
    • Meta: Stimulating discussion about JSRs on the SE/EE list. e.g. we didn’t publicise our concerns about JSR 351 on the SE/EE EC alias – and I think a lot of other members would have had more concerns if we’d spoken up on-list
  • Adopt a JSR program
    • Progress Reports on existing Adopted JSRs
    • Discussion on where we go next with this
    • Publicising the list of people who have joined the program back to the LJC (and beyond)
  • Adopt the OpenJDK program
  • Discuss candidates for the upcoming JCP elections
  • Other business


  • Issues from last meeting were reviewed
  • JSR-331 – BE to send to SE/EE list saying we’re going to vote no and here’s why. Before he does, check with Werner Kiel.
    • We need to list our criteria for voting on any JSR on the wiki (MB)
    • We need to update our voting record on (BE/MB)
  • Look into into 333 for our voting stance (MB)
  • Accept 351 invitation for webinar (BE)
    • solicit comments before the vote (BE to ask Patrick)
  • Launch Adopt a JSR by end of Oct (MV)
    • 350 report, new project, (SM will adopt a JSR)
    • Submit a BOF on JSR-310 at Open Conference (JG)
    • Find people to ‘Adopt the JMS 2.0 JSR’, (TG talk to BE)
  • Set up a JCP Committee voting poll (MV)
    • Post early endorsement of a candidate (BE/MV)
    • Promote this election (All of us)
  • Lead an ‘Adopt an OpenJDK’ (TBA)
    • Get a collection of LJC people to work on the build (MV)
    • Propose Oracle to allow JEPs without being a committer (MV/BE/TG/MB at Devoxx)
  • Next meeting to be scheduled for November, the week after Devoxx (BE/MV)
  • We need to have our contact details in a Shared Document (Everyone)
  • Martijn to buy the next lot of Wine (MV)
Martijn (On behalf of the LJC JCP Committee)

Hi all,

We realised that at the recent Open Conference that there were a lot of new faces to the LJC. It has been 6 months since we won the elected seat for the JCP Executive Committee (EC) and formed our own committee to review and vote on JSRs (and deal with any other JCP activity).

There have been a number of posts to this list on the topic of the committee and it’s activities, but we thought we’d better bring it all together under one post with regards to how it came to be, its structure and how you can join in!

What’s the goal of this Committee?

  1. Primarily we want openness and transparency in the creation of Java Standards.
  2. Equally as important, we want the end users of these standards (that would be Java developers) to have a say in the standard before it becomes ratified.

What if I don’t agree with the committee?

We don’t own anybody!

The reality is that with >2000 members, all we can do is try to represent you as best as possible. We do this by canvassing opinions, especially at events such as the developer sessions, talks and of course, the recent open conference. You’ve probably also seen the regular blog posts and mails asking for feedback as well.

‘Adopt a JSR’ is yet another feedback mechanism we have in place.

We especially want to hear from you if you do disagree with us! The wide range of opinions we have, the more accurately we vote for the community at large. And of course you can join the committee and add your direct vote (see “How do I join?” below).

Who’s currently on the Committee

  • Ben Evans (The designated rep for JCP EC meetings)
  • Martijn Verburg (secondary rep)
  • Trisha Gee (tertiary rep)
  • James Gough
  • Richard Warburton
  • Simon Maple
  • Michael Barker
  • Somay Nakhal

And of course Barry Cranford keeps his hand in as the Founder of the LJC and keen ‘Adopt a JSR’ supporter.

How did this committee form?

We originally sent out several posts asking for volunteers for the LJC JCP Committee. The initial group of people that volunteered was Ben Evans, Martijn Verburg, Trisha Gee, Simon Maple & James Gough. Michael Barker, Richard Warburton and Somay Nakhal have been added since (see “How do I join?” below).

How do I join?

The JCP Committee consists of a “meritocracy of the willing”. That is, if you want to join and are willing to put the effort in then after a couple of monthly meetings the committee adds you in (after a simple majority vote). So far everyone that has wanted to join has been accepted, we’re very much an open shop on that front!

The barrier to entry is relatively low. The minimum requirement is that you put in some effort – that is:

  1. Regularly turn up to the monthly meetings
  2. Actively review JSRs
  3. Support programs such as ‘Adopt a JSR’
  4. Write the occasional blog post

It helps to have a good understanding of the overall Java ecosystem and some open source and software patent laws, but we can mentor people in all of those areas. The time effort required is typically about 5 hours a week for a committee member, with the JCP EC reps putting in extra hours for EC meetings and extended research (10-20 hours/week).

Travel is required for the primary rep (or the appropriate back up) for a F2F meeting 3-4 times a year. As we are a Java User Group – Oracle picks up the flight and accommodation expenses for that rep (we’re talking economy class and a reasonable hotel, so this isn’t the 5* perk the rep was looking for ;p).

How does the committee vote/organise itself?

Simple majority voting applies, this includes voting who the primary, secondary & tertiary reps are and voting on JSRs etc.

Is the mailing list public?

Sadly not. This is the unfortunate reality of discussing legal issues (under NDA in some cases) and other information that the committee is given in strictest confidence.

So what do you make public then?

Everything that we possibly can! So our minutes (with some legal stuff redacted), our voting strategy and record. We’re certainly the most open and transparent member of the JCP EC and are encouraging the other members to follow suit.

Hopefully that answers most people’s questions but of course any and all feedback is welcome!


Martijn (on behalf of the LJC JCP committee)

During our most recent JCP meeting we decided that we should write down the criteria we apply when deciding how to vote on a JSR.  Most of the criteria derive from our desire to represent a large body of developers.  None of the criteria represent absolute lines in the sand.  We are willing to compromise on some or all of the areas that we value depending on the JSR.  It’s not possible to come up a rigid definition of what is required for a JSR to pass, otherwise you could just replace the LJC JCP Committee with small shell script.  So the criteria we apply is a bit like ‘The Pirate’s Code’, more of a guideline really.


This is one of our primary concerns.  How transparent is the process of developing the JSR.  For a long time a lot of the JSRs were put together in a manner that was invisible to the rest of the Java community.  We’ve been quite outspoken in our support of JSR 348 (aka which seeks to increase the transparency of the process.  We also included a strong statement during our vote on the Java 7 specification regarding the lack of visibility of some private mailing list content.  We are actively encouraging existing JSRs that started under older version of the JCP process to attempt to meet the transparency requirements of JSR 348.

User & Vendor Participation

Anyone remember EJB 1.0/2.0?  Anybody who does will remember a lot of pain.  It is our belief that the earlier versions of the EJB standard were the result of too much vendor control of the specification.  If one looks at the current specification of JPA (Java Persistence API) when compared to the older Entity Beans specification, it is very clear that the JPA has been driven heavily by open source/user focused tools such as Hibernate and EclipseLink (formally TopLink), whereas as the older Entity Beans was difficult to use and awkward to make efficient.  There was a very clear statement made during the development of JavaEE 5 that developer productivity was the main focus.  It is our feeling that this should be front and center of all work done in the JCP, and to ensure that this happens there should always be end user representation on the JSR expert group.

Open Source RI and TCK

One of the largest areas of controversy around the JCP was inability for the Apache Harmony project to get access to the Java TCK under a license that was acceptable to them and the resulting fallout.  While the Harmony PMC has voted to move the project to the Apache Attic and IBM have now agreed to work with Oracle on the OpenJDK, there is still an important lesson here.  To have an effective specification, the TCK should be open and accessible to all implementors.  We understand that commercial and legal constraints may prevent this, it won’t prevent us from asking for an open TCK or commenting on its absence.  We are even actively participating the the creation of a TCK for new Date/Time API (JSR 310).

Does it Work Well as a Specification

Is it something that really requires a specification?  An example of a JSR that works well, as a specification is the JMS (Java Messaging Specification).  Messaging as concept is an important aspect of enterprise systems making it a strong candidate for a standardised API.  There is a very rich market of commercial and open source messaging products and the success of the specification is backed up by the number of implementations that are available (~15 listed on Wikipedia).  Recently we voted no on JSR 351 (Java Identity API).  One of the reasons for that was a lack of existing implementations, and we suggested building out an open source implementation first.

General Merit

As a catch all we look at the overall importance of the JSR itself.  For example, while we weren’t happy with all aspects of the Java 7 JSR, we felt that it was too important to vote against.  Moving Java forward held greater importance than ensuring that every email produced during the development of Project Coin was publicly available.

If you feel that there are other criteria that should be applied by the LJC JCP Committee when assessing JSRs, then feel free to contact us.  Either on the LJC mailing list or directly, we tend to be at a lot of the meetups if you want to chat face to face.

Hi all,

After much thought and consideration the LJC JCP Committee have cast their votes for the JCP elections (Look for the Executive Committee Elections heading at  We’re making our vote public and will give our reasons according to the openness and transparency requirements for the committee.

The list of nominees for the SE/EE seats and the ME seats are as follows:

There were 3 ratified seats and 2 open seats up for election in both the ME and SE/EE ECs.  Although it may seem like the ratified seats are shoe-ins since to the number of candidates == the number of available seats, enough no votes can make a candidate ineligible to take the seat.

SE/EE Ratified Seat Vote

Ericsson AB, Intel and SAP all get yes votes – they are important players in the Java ecosystem and in Ericsson’s case we are also looking to the future of the combined SE/EE/ME EC, where mobile expertise will be required.

SE/EE Open Seat Vote

This was a very close vote as the strength of candidates was unprecedented. Azul Systems and Twitter Inc narrowly ran out as winners for our yes votes with CloudBees losing out by the narrowest of margins.

So despite not getting our vote this time around, a special mention goes out to Steve Harris of CloudBees.  We’d like to thank him for his amazing work at Oracle with JEE and look forward to seeing what his leadership will bring for the EE ecosystem working at CloudBees.

ME Ratified Seat Vote

IBM and Nokia get yes votes as they large global players and have been active participants in the ME EC

SK Telecom receive a no vote because of their attendance and participation record.

ME Open Seat Vote

ARM and Alex Terrazas get our yes votes.

  • ARM because it is vital that Java has a strong story to tell with regards to ARM chipsets.
  • Alex because he’s bought real effort and a breath of fresh air into an ME EC that was largely full of absent members.  His expertise in the embedded space and unusual applications of that (biological interfaces) brings a much needed technical slant to the ME EC.


Although the Committee has voted for and endorsed these particular candidates, any LJC member who is also a JCP member can (and no doubt will) vote any way they wish to.


Martijn (on behalf of the LJC JCP committee – Ben E, Martijn V, Trisha G, James G, Richard W, Simon M, Mike B, Somay N)

A couple of weeks ago we (Trisha and Martijn) were fortunate enough to represent the LJC at JavaOne in San Francisco.  There has already been a lot said about JavaOne 2011 (and our talks etc there), so this post will focus on the LJC activities. There were two main areas for us to focus on:

  1. Our seat on the Java Community Process (JCP) Executive Committee (EC) gave us opportunities to meet the right people in order to discuss the high level problems facing the Java platform today.
  2. Getting to know the other Java User Groups (JUGs) that are out there, learn from what they’re doing and tell them about the cool stuff we get up to!

After User Group and community Sunday, which had several sessions on both user groups and the JCP, it was clear that the involvement of two major communities (us and the Brazilian JUG – SouJava) in the JCP EC had woken people up.  We both had many conversations with people from organisations who had previously seen the JCP as largely irrelevant, but now were not only taking notice but contemplating getting involved themselves!

It’s pure speculation, of course, but it seems that our involvement along with SouJava’s sparked a number of the current list of candidates to nominate themselves.

Oracle provided plenty of opportunities to get to know all the players in the JCP, and they were also trying their best to understand the ecosystem of the community.  There were sessions, lunches, BOFs and dinners giving us plenty of opportunities to mingle, get to know people and share ideas. And lots of free drink.  We like to think that the Developer Sessions have provided us with the training required to maintain a professional, technically-minded conversation after a small glass or two :-).

It was great to be nominated for the JCP awards, and we got a nice nod from a couple of the winners who acknowledged that we’d shaken things up in the space in a good way.

The Thursday keynote brought together a lot of the themes from the week around community, Martijn represented us up on stage.  We announced the intent to launch our ‘Adopt a JSR’ program globally across all JUGs and other organisations which was well received by the crowd and generally extolled people to join their local JUG and make things happen. It was a really great way to round off the conference, to highlight that ultimately without us, the developers, the whole platform would be pretty pointless.

People were genuinely impressed with the number of members we have in the LJC (over 1900) and even more so by the numbers who actively participate, either coming to events or on the mailing list (or both).  It made us feel proud to be part of such an active and diverse community.

However it did get us thinking about even more things we could do – in particular, lots of these people want to see the cool events we organise and get involved even though they’re not in London.  It’s something we’ve always wanted to provide but seems like a lot of work, but we’re hoping to make this happen with streaming and /or recordings of our events via

The other thing that inspired us was being present at two different live podcast events.  We’re totally excited about the whole podcast thing, even though listening to one on Trisha’s way to work would probably result in Certain Death for her (she bikes to work).  It’s a great way to build a community. Literally having a voice and a tone is a great way to engage people.  It’s a natural extension of the aggregated blogs (which, incidentally, people we spoke to loved). Needless to say our first podcast will be coming soon!

What the LJC can take away from JavaOne is:

  1. Oracle is definitely committed to regular, on-time big-number releases for the Java platform, and have a reasonable release plan with rough ideas of what could be in 8 and 9.
  2. Java has a community that other languages can only dream of (that’s us), and Oracle is also keen to support that.
  3. The JCP, after years of floundering in the wilderness, is finding a purpose in life, and other organisations are seeing this and want a part of it
  4. We, the LJC, have an amazing community with some great events, great ideas and great members.  We have even more ideas we can implement.
Trisha and Martijn

It was a superb evening on Tuesday night, thanks to Trisha and Mike for giving the presentation ‘Understanding the Disruptor, a Beginner’s Guide to Hardcore Concurrency’ – 12 reviews and just shy of 5 *s!

I have to say it really is rare that we get as much positive feedback as we did on Tuesday night.

Thanks also to Somay, Ged and Peter for the lightning talks. If you have the slides available please upload them to the LJC meetup page, or if they’re available online somewhere please add the comment to the event:

Thanks also to Steve and PlayFish – as I said last night we couldn’t ask for better hosts, especially with the beer fridge open all night.

Thanks finally to JAX London for the pizzas and free tickets (congrats Dan/Richard). For those still to check out JAX London then visit 3 weeks to go and Trish/Mike and 60 other presenters will be speaking.

I hope you had a good night. If you are potentially interested in a new position please check out our latest roles on our job page:

Thanks again all,


Packt Publishing is pleased to announce the finalists of the 2011 Open Source Award. This announcement signals the start of the next stage where the finalists are now open to public vote, which lasts until October 31.

The finalists, listed in alphabetical order across all the categories, are as follows:

  • Open Source CMS Award
    • Drupal
    • Joomla!
    • mojoPortal
    • Plone
    • SilverStripe
  • Open Source Mobile Toolkits and Libraries
    • FoneMonkey
    • jQuery Mobile
    • Min3D
    • PhoneGap
    • Sencha Touch
  • Most Promising Open Source Project
    • Chamilo
    • FLOW3
    • ImpressPages
    • Nette Framework
    • Seo Panel
  • Open Source Business Applications
    • Magento
    • NopCommerce
    • OpenCart
    • PrestaShop
    • SugarCRM
  • Open Source JavaScript Libraries
    • Dojo Toolkit
    • jQuery
    • Raphael JS
    • Sencha- ExtJS
    • YUI Library
  • Open Source Graphics Software
    • Airtime
    • Blender
    • GIMP
    • Inkscape
    • Krita

Users are invited to vote for their favorite open source projects across all the applicable categories and maximize their chances of winning their share of $24,000. Public votes will be combined with ratings from a panel of Judges with the winners announced on November 7.

Packt is giving away an Amazon Kindle to a lucky winner chosen randomly from the voting stage. To ensure you have a chance of winning, vote now.

In other Awards news, Packt has introduced subcategories to the 2011 Open Source Awards finals for the CMS and JavaScript Library categories. To read more, click here.

For more information, please visit:


  • Simon Maple
  • Richard Warburton
  • Somay Nakhal
  • Ben Evans
  • James Gough
  • Martijn Verburg
  • Trish Gee
  • Mike Barker

(Tasks in Bold)

General Minutes 
  • Welcome Somay Nakhal to the Committee!
  • We need to start having formal agendas before each meeting (MV to create next one)
  • We’d like to have a venue with free WiFi for all  (TG to investigate possibilities)
Update from Face to Face (F2F) EC meeting from BE
  • Hosted at Goldman Sachs in Jersey City, USA
  • Good to put names to faces, made following JSR-348 WG meeting run more easily
  • LJC ‘Adopt a JSR’ program was well received
  • Lots of support for JSR-310
  • JSR-348
    • Main issue was about ballot stuffing.  The PMO will investigate and act appropriately if there is evidence of suspicious voting.
    • SE and ME committees will merge (partly as ME committee rarely makes quorum).
    • 24 seats + chair is the new target, down from 32 today, ‘extra’ seats will die a natural death.
  • Java ME
    • Hardware baseline – so price point drops over time?  In our opinion this does not match what the industry is doing.
    • Code line is currently based off 1.4.2, they’re proposing to do an ME7, base lined against SE 7 but with some features (like invokedynamic) will be removed.
    • ME seems to be heading towards the embedded space.
    • ME for SE developers LJC session by Oracle to help us gain insight into this area of standards (MV to organise).
  • ‘Adopt a JSR program’ is vital. We shall proceed by:
    • Update with our JCP status (MB to follow up)
      • Blog about JSPA signature (BE to post)
    • Producing a Glossary of Terms (TG to update wiki)
    • Push out the ‘Adopt a JSR Program’ post (RW)
      • Give Richard access to LJC blog (MV)
      • Forward post to JUG leaders list during JavaOne once done (MV)
    • Send out details of our page to committee  (MV)
    • At the next JCP meeting, review our JCP/JSR Content on (all of us)
    • Adopt a JSR Logo – CC licensed Duke needs you (MV)
JSR-310 update (JG)
  • Blog post on TCKs etc (JG)
  • Volunteer Cat herding (JG)
  • Next step is to start the TCK planning stage (JG)
  • Contact threeten mailing list (JG)
  • Workshop on TCK at Open Conference (JG)
  • Get Oracle involved – Roger Riggs – (BE)
JSR-349 (Bean Validation)
  • Looking for adoptees, get Spec lead to send out a description (MV)

JSR-350 (session state enhancement)

  • Adopt a JSR – Introduce Madhu Konda and SN (BE)
  • Investigation, talk to Jeff Trent (and his upcoming replacement) (SN)

JSR-351  – Identity Management

  • Contact spec lead for further clarification of JSR  (BE)

What is the LJC

The London Java Community (LJC) is a group of Java Enthusiasts who are interested in benefiting from shared knowledge in the industry. Through our forum and regular meetings you can keep in touch with the latest industry developments, learn new Java (& other JVM) technologies, meet other developers, discuss technical/non technical issues and network further throughout the Java Community.